Show Highlights
You can't Tier 2 or 3 yourself out of a Tier 1 problem.
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Beyond the Institution: Redesigning School Spaces
Danny
Absolutely. So I want to start talking about intentional space design teaching, and being an administrator, being a student. And often schools were kind of dreary, very institutional, terrible lighting. It wasn't an exciting place that I wanted to be in. And I know that you're very passionate about designing school spaces that are not traditional or institutional. So can you talk about the design process at the district level?
07:12
Dr Vitale
Sure, I'd love to. First of all, I should begin with school superintendents and our training. Even in our doctoral level classes, we don't get any training on school construction. We might talk, and today there's a little more discussion surrounding learning spaces. But in my undergrad training, graduate training, and my doctoral level training, I never talked about that. And I always thought, I never want to be involved in construction because that's not really my forte. I want to be involved in instruction, not construction, but ministry. Absolutely. We're outgrowing our buildings, and they're old, and like many districts in, you know, haven't really saved to update buildings. And so we reached a point at Seneca Valley where we were growing again, and it was time for an older building to be so, you know, we began down this path knowing very little about school construction.
08:20
Dr Vitale
Most school leaders, school board members, know very little. You might have a board member who has some background in construction, and hopefully your director of buildings and grounds has a little bit of background. But the reality is, I can work with our business manager on funding. I'd like to think I'm pretty good at getting teachers what they need. I see myself as kind of like the resource queen sometimes. You got a good idea, I'll find a way to fund it. But what I wasn't prepared for was $100 million. That's bigger than I pride myself on. If I can find a million in a year to get an initiative off the ground for a teacher, that's huge, because, let's face it, if I knew how to make 3 million, I probably would be talking to you from a different scenery, nevertheless.
So it's just not an area that school superintendents are well versed in. So when we went down this path of looking at first feasibility studies, what do we do with the old buildings? Can they renovate? Or is it time you look at a car and you say, at what point? Do you just need a new car? So we had reached that point, we'd be researching around 1516 where to start first, because we have many old buildings. And so the board, after feasibility studies, after bringing in construction managers, construction experts, engineers, decided that it was time to replace our oldest building, which was designed to be a high school, and then morphed over the years into an elementary school. So that happens a lot in the United States. And so when I told my husband I was embarking on this journey of construction that I knew nothing about and he knows nothing about, he said, whatever you do, just don't build another institution. Now, I don't like to give him a lot of credit, so I'm hoping he doesn't listen to this podcast.
10:24
Danny
I won't send it to him because.
10:25
Dr Vitale
I'd like to take it. Okay. I take good ideas from everyone. And I thought about the institution. I was a little offended at first. We don't have institutions. What does he mean? And I got very defensive. And then one day, not long after that conversation, I was walking through our intermediate high school, which is a 910 building, and the walls were so drab. We must have had a discount on state paint that year, because I thought, okay, I need to look at this differently. This yellow, pale yellow paint. This is what he's talking about in this long hall that almost looks like a hospital, not a school. Shame on me. Have I become part of these institutions? And I don't see it. So from that point on, it was like an epiphany. That's it.
11:19
Dr Vitale
I said to my team, where can we find some of the newest schools that have been built in the United States? Where can we find schools outside of the United States? And we just began on this journey as a team, trying to find the coolest environment for a school that we could find. And really what we did was we set out to not build a school at all. And this new building that we just opened is called Irman Elementary Ermine Middle School. It opened in 2002. So we're about a year and a half into utilizing this building. Brand new building. It, to our surprise, was recognized by Times magazine as one of the best 200 inventions in 2022, which we never set out to do. Again, this is social media the Times magazine Time found us.
12:11
Dr Vitale
Again, we didn't set out to design an award winning building. We set out to design not an institution, not a school. But instead we settled on, let's design a school, especially an elementary, lower level, middle school, as kind of like a children's museum. I'm a big fan of museums. I love museums, especially children's museums. They're very hands on. So we hired a consultant from the Children's Museum of Pittsburgh and Fulham. She sat with us at design, and there's no doubt through all the design processes, all the pictures we looked at, all the things that she said would maybe work in a school. We went and visited the children's museum again. I had been there, but went again to Pittsburgh and took our whole leadership team and said, what do you love about this learning space?
13:05
Dr Vitale
And then we tried to replicate that in a school. So it's easy to build on the perimeter. That's easy. But I was not going to do that. Number one, to prove my husband wrong, but number two, I just wanted this to be an environment where as soon as kids saw the building from the outside, be excited, right. That they would be like, wait, is this a school? And then when they walked inside, was this still a school? It does not look like a school, which I love.
13:39
Danny
So can you paint a picture of what kids and staff experience as they enter this building? Just because this is an audio format. Right. And I bet right now people are getting excited. Okay, so you did build an institution. We get what a museum could be like, especially a kids museum. But what are some of the things that we might see or hear or experience?
14:02
Dr Vitale
I was really focused on and taken by all the museums I had visited. And I also had this amazing opportunity to visit the schools in Finland back in 2017. I think that was. And so that really impacted the way I think about schools and what they could be in America as well. So there's a little taste of the Finnish schools. There's a taste of our Pittsburgh children's museum. There are pieces that, all good ideas should be replicated, in my opinion. And you may not be able to do that necessarily in the business world with patents, but in schools and in education, we love to steal good ideas and give people credit. The Carnegie Science Museum here in Pittsburgh, I always loved when I was in that with my younger children, the big ramp, like, you didn't have to take the steps. Those are boring. You didn't have to take one of these circular ramps in the Helsinki library. It was a newer library when I had visited, and I thought, what a cool space like this is a learning space. So we have a circular ramp as soon as you open the foyer doors, and that is the first thing the kids see. That, too, is a learning space. And where we really landed through all of this brainstorming and meeting with stakeholders and involving a lot of people over many years, we landed. I kept pushing this notion that the building should be a teaching tool. It should be part of the learning, part of the teaching.
15:40
Dr Vitale
It shouldn't be just a space where we learn, but in every aspect of the building, there are little curious and curious questions that we pose throughout the outside of the building before you come into the building. So as soon as you park your car and look at the building, there are curious questions as soon as you come to the front of the building about why these pillars are angled? What are these measurements? This measures x amount of kips. What are kips? So we have metric, we have standard measurements, but we don't give the answers away. But the adults, too, are thinking about, what is the story here? What's going on here with these beams that are holding the canopy up? And in the.
16:48
Dr Vitale
Another question, I will tell you, I'd love for you to come see the building, but we'd love to have you in our canopy. I insisted that the lights portray the night sky in the month that we would open the building. And so they are placed in star constellations, what the September sky looked like in western Pennsylvania when we opened the building in the fall of 2022. But we don't give that away. We pose questions about, what do you think? What could these be that cost us? Nothing. So there are a lot of unique design components that are very cost efficient as well.
17:30
Danny
Yeah. Offline. We'll talk about a visit, because I feel like I have to see the place now. You're making me want to come.
17:38
Dr Vitale
It's a fun place. It's really a fun place for all learners of all ages.
17:42
Danny
And if we could backtrack a bit. I latched onto this idea because, big reason I didn't tell you this in the pre chat before we hit record, but this show was created because of the gaps that I found in my leadership. Right. The things that weren't taught at graduate school or within the district or whatever on how to be more effective as a leader. And I just knew. And so I figured if I talk to the Dr. Vitals of the world, learn from your stories of success and failure, and most importantly, implement one idea that you teach me, then I would grow, and I didn't know that it would change my life by doing this learning in public. But you've identified it. Sounds like a big gap for superintendents in terms of construction and designing learning spaces. Can you give an overview?
18:32
Danny
Because I don't think we'll have time to get into the nitty gritty details. You don't have to give a master class on this either, but just some sort of like, the big ideas of what a superintendent needs to sort of process when considering creating a new building that's not an institution. Right. Does that question make sense?
18:52
Dr Vitale
Yes, but it goes back even further that all of my ideas would not have put together a very good building. I'm one person, and I'm not the whole answer for a large community like Seneca Valley. And so we have 53,000 constituents. We have very diverse thinking, very different political parties on both sides of the aisle. And so how do you bring all these ideas of what people want in a building from all different ages? And therefore, I think even to go into a project like this, where I was lucky, where I had things in place that I didn't realize at the time when I was an assistant superintendent, I revamped the entire hiring process. That's really my expertise. Teacher selection. How do you find good teachers? How do you get them to the table? How do you recruit once they're there?
19:56
Dr Vitale
How do you grow them? How do you retain them? And that's a huge discussion right now in our country with the teacher shortages in schools, which is very different from the business world. And so I really focused on relationships. I focused on listening to people who had totally different ideas than me. And I might initially get defensive, like I did with my husband when he said, don't build another institution. But then being curious, saying, well, tell me what you mean by that. Let me think more deeply about that. And can I put my own ego, this person in front of me, whether they're an educator or not? And I think having a good team in place is what made this building so amazing. Good leaders, good teacher leaders, good administrators, good construction managers. It just was a whole conglomerate of people.
20:58
Dr Vitale
Because I might have had an idea of what the playground should have looked like based on a playground I saw in Helsinki. But what should that look like in the United States in our, I think those are the pieces that we sometimes miss the mark on with leadership in general, teachers or administrators. But the huge gap, even if I had a class in school construction, I'm not sure it would have helped me as much as getting the right experts to the table. And that is because of relationships. That is because of honoring diverse voices. That is because of setting aside your ego as a leader and saying, maybe I don't know everything, even after 28 years, and I don't involve stakeholders. But most importantly, we're not taught this as superintendents. I hope this is changing.
22:24
Danny
Solve this problem that we're facing. And the challenge is to not evaluate any idea as bad or dumb or wouldn't ever work. To get that judging mind out of the way, throw it all down. And what you'll find is some of those wild ideas are actually like really great solutions. I appreciate you sharing that and tapping into students. Actually, before we get to students, one more question. Obviously Helsinki, Finland. You were really inspired by spaces there. Pittsburgh and Children's Museum. I heard you say, were there any other spaces around the US? You might just tell the ruckus maker listening. Hey, check out what this school is doing in terms of how it's designed. It's a pretty cool thing to see and experience. We had a difficult time finding creative elementaries. Isn't that kind of sad?
23:19
Danny
It's very sad, actually.
23:21
Dr Vitale
If our most creative, craziest looking building should be elementaries, I'm now looking for high schools. And when I ask my colleagues, I get one or two, you know, maybe this school in California. I'm researching because of cost, that's one of the main driving forces, right? Because you have to be able to pay for it. And so that's another reason we build these square boxes, because it's cheaper. But we're at a time where kids won't sit in cubicles and square boxes and work anymore. So why are we doing this in schools? Why do we still have this factory model after all these years? And so I don't have a lot that I could prop up.
24:10
Dr Vitale
I did some neighboring newer schools who I was like, okay, I like the way they're using light, natural light, and Helsinki is known for that. All the Finnish schools are about getting kids outdoors. And when they're inside in the cold winter months, bringing the outdoors in through a lot of glass. And when I first started looking at it, I wanted a lot of glass, I wanted to bring the outside in. I want these spatial sight lines to be out in every room we're in. I started getting some and we built institutions. But I would argue if you are willing to be creative enough and listen to diverse voices, student voices, people of all ages, people in all different industries. You can still do it efficiently and cheaply, but it takes time. We were five years planning this out before we ever had design on paper.
25:13
Dr Vitale
A lot of research went into it before we hired the architects. Then the architects, of course, added to that. But before we brought architects in, we needed an idea of what we were looking for. And this building is shaped to explain from an audio perspective, like a Y. As you come in, that's the base of the Y. And then they branch out and it's two stories. On one side we have k to four, kindergarten to fourth grade, and on the other side, fifth and 6th. And they share specials. And the ramp leads you to our amazing kindergarten wing because you are curious. The proof is in the pudding. Like the ramp did. It cost us a lot of money, almost a million dollars. And people would say, I would have used that in classrooms. What to add to the box.
26:02
Dr Vitale
I really pushed and fought our stakeholders to spend the money on the ramp. And the proof is in the pudding. The first day we opened, I'm at the building. I went to all the buildings on the first day, but I wanted to be there when those buses arrived. And we always have some criers, kindergartners, they're afraid to leave home. They have some school phobias. And this was the least amount of criers we ever had. And one young lady, her mom walked her to the door, she wouldn't get on the bus. And I got down at her eye level, grabbed her hand, and I said, I'm Dr. Vitel, can I walk you in? And she said. Shook her head, I'm not sure. And I said, have you been in this building? Did you see the ramp? And she said, ramp? And I said, let me show you the ramp. And the doors opened and she saw this circular ramp and she looked up at me and, with a big smile, didn't know where her mother was at this point, didn't care, and said, I love that ramp. That's all she cared about. I love that ramp. Proof is in the pudding, right? And the kids still love it. And the adults still love it. And talk about getting your exercise. This ramp, the kids walk more in the building than they do taking. There are steps that they can take and there are steps on the five, six sides, but you're trying to pique their curiosity. They're full of energy. We can do things differently. We need to do things differently.
27:34
Danny
100%. And in my first book, I talked about how Disney shouldn't be the most magical place on earth. It should be our schools, and they're not. And so, again, isn't that kind of sad? Because it's not that Disney does have an advantage with their budget. Of course. And their human resources and their team. But the reason Disney works is not the money where kids can imagine and be curious and learn and play and have fun. I think that's something that you believe, too. It's coming through in the design of your elementary school here. And I just want to commend you on the work you're doing. I'd like to shift a bit to sort of like students and teachers. And since we're talking about shifts, the traditional model is like lecturing.
28:32
Danny
Teaching, maybe even, God forbid, but there's still classrooms, right? Rows and all this kind of stuff. And I talk about how teachers should move from imparting or banking knowledge to co-creating wisdom with students. And you believe teachers should be coaches and facilitators. Would you like to riff on that perspective at all and how you maybe help teachers see themselves as coach and facilitator versus traditional lecturer?
29:02
Dr Vitale
What's interesting, just this morning I was having a text exchange with our three assistant superintendents about teacher talk versus student talk in the classroom. In traditional classrooms, the teachers do the majority of the talking. I'm guilty. I'm the former. I like to call myself a rehabilitated middle school english teacher and a senior high english teacher who would have been put out of business by now with Chat GPT. But that's a discussion, maybe for later. So how can we get teachers to reflect without it being so evaluative? Because if I say, hey, did you ever think maybe you talked too much and maybe we should let the kids talk more? It's about learning more than it is about when my husband said, don't build another institution, that's not how I want to be treated. That's not how I personally grow.
29:57
Dr Vitale
In order for me to grow, I need to be curious. We think adult learning theory is different from children's learning theory, but it's not right. We all want to have a say in our learning. I don't want to read a book that you make me read. If we learned anything through the pandemic, it should have been that people want choice. Adults and kids give me a choice in my learning. Let me have a say in my learning. Regardless of my age. I don't care if you're four or five or you are 60 or 70. Let me have a choice. And so I think we have to approach teachers, and we try to, at Seneca Valley, we are not perfect. We're trying to get better every day about choices.
30:45
Dr Vitale
And so the question would be, have you ever thought about teacher talk versus student talk? And what do you want your classroom to be, and what's the research out there? Because there's a lot of research on why kids should be talking more than teachers in the classroom. And I don't mean unorganized, chaotic talk, although chaos is okay sometimes as well. But we're even beyond that. Whole teachers should be on the side as the sage instead of being on the stage. We're beyond that. We need to be in a place, the Internet, information technology, AI, that has replaced kids and don't need me to deliver information anymore. They need me to help them organize and to assess the information and to evaluate the information. That's how my job should be changing as a teacher. And our best, our master teachers, they got that a long time ago. And when I walk into those classrooms, they just blend like they're not standing in the front. As a matter of fact, we let the teachers in this new building choose their furniture. They did not choose a stationary desk.
32:04
Danny
How about that?
32:04
Dr Vitale
There's a desk kind of built into some cabinets. They chose a technology podium, for lack of a better word, on wheels, that they can move around should they need it. But if you go into any of these elementary classrooms, and especially in the new building, the building kind of supports that whole notion of, hey, I'm moving around with the kids. I'm a learner in this classroom, and I might be facilitating some of this, but I'm not leading all the learning, but I'm guiding it.
32:38
Danny
Yeah. That's so good. Do you know the company TeachfX, by any chance?
32:43
Dr Vitale
I think that was one of the products we were looking at. Where is this the one where you record yourself as a teacher and it'll let you know how much you talked versus the kids? We're looking at that as one of the products and trying to. Again, we don't want to rule out a product that a teacher will fear. Who's going to listen to this? And will the superintendent be listening to it? And will my principal knock me down on my evaluation? That's not what it's about. It's about growth. And so a product like that, we would try to pilot with volunteer teachers who hold the data themselves for reflection.
33:21
Danny
I bring it into the conversation because they've sponsored the podcast for years and I know the schools that use it are obviously seeing positive results. And since you brought up teacher talk time versus student talk, I just wanted to make sure you knew about it or the ruckus maker listening knew about it as well. All right, great. I really enjoyed our conversation. I don't want it to end. Let me ask you one more question. And I've been asking this to all my superintendent guests, but basically with Einstein, he famously talked about if he had a problem to solve, he'd ask a question to ask and then spend 5 minutes to actually answer the question. Right. So I'm just curious as we end, you know, what's a question you would hope that more educators were asking right now?
34:23
Dr Vitale
What is AI? How will it impact teaching and learning? And I'm not as smart as Einstein, so I would spend my 55 minutes talking to kids about this.
34:38
Danny
Brilliant. Well, thanks so much for being a guest.
34:42
Dr Vitale
Thank you for having me.
34:42
Danny
I appreciate you.
A First Year Principal Wonders If Balance Is A Real Thing
Hey, just like with every show, I want to start off with an abundance of gratitude because you could be doing anything right now, and you're listening to this show. So seriously, thanks for hitting play. And if you love exploring how to scroll differently so you can make a legendary impact on your campus, you're in the right place. My name is Danny Bauer, and this is the better leaders, better Schools podcast, the original Ruckus Maker podcast for visionary leaders, innovators, and rebels in education. Thanks to Ruckus Makers just like you, this show ranks, believe it or not, in the top 0.5% of all shows in all industries on all topics worldwide. And that's because you listen. So thanks again. In today's conversation, I spoke with a new principal named Ryan.
00:51
Danny
He's in year number one, and we'll be working together here on the show and getting him successfully ending the school year and launching year number two. Now, I think the time that this show goes live, it's actually, he's started year number two and you're listening in September, but we actually recorded in March of last year. Now, we covered topics that I think you'll find interesting. We get into entry plans and 90 day plans. We talk a bit about, like, non negotiables, why it's important also to take a big, broad perspective and make it smaller and smaller, tighter and more focused and really the meat of the conversation and got into this idea of balance, right, and not always being on and being there, available to family and especially for his kids. I suspect that conversation will continue. And if that's an issue that you are working with, I think you'll find the episode fascinating. So buckle in. We're about to start this conversation, this coaching call. But let's first get some messages in from our show sponsors. Hey, Ruckus Maker, I'll make this quick. If you're listening to this message right now, you're missing out. When you subscribe to the Ruckus Maker newsletter on Substack, you get access to micro books focused on how to do school different tools and other resources that will help you make a ruckus and do school different stories and case studies of the world's most legendary Ruckus Makers of all time. Access to my calendar to schedule coaching sessions, and you'll also get bonus podcast content that won't be released on the main podcast feed and podcast episodes without any advertisements.
02:49
Danny
So if you love this show, if it's helped you grow and you want access to more tools and resources that will help you make a ruckus and do school different and become a paid subscriber at Ruckusmakers.substack.com. I'm sure you've heard that energy flows to where attention goes, right? If you want to get more of what you want when you want it, as a school leader, I've got a tool for you. The secret is to celebrate the positive things happening on campus and to go multiple levels deeper, to tap into why it even matters when you do that. Anything is possible on your campus, and I mean anything. And you start to get more of what you want when you want it.
If you'd like to spread more positivity and create more value for all stakeholders on your campus, go to betterleadersbetterschools.com positive and download your free tool today. So long time listeners and Ruckus Makers definitely know Mitch weathers. He founded Organized Binder, and he wrote a recent book, executive functions for every classroom. Now this book is absolutely amazing. He has a saying, you can't tier three or tier two yourself out of a tier one problem. And a missing component of much of tier one instruction is this idea of executive functions. When kids get it, everything is unlocked for them. They're able to succeed, achieve at much higher levels. Like I said, the book has done really well. It's become a bestseller in less than six months. And to celebrate, Mitche has put together a really generous opportunity, which is you could get 30% off the book in free shipping. So go. Go to organizedbinder.com/ruckus and then when you check out, use the code RucKUS 30. Now spell ruckus all caps and 30 for 30 to get that 30% discount and free shipping. So one more time, grab executive functions for every classroom. Go to organizedbinder.com/ruckus and use the code ruckus 30 for that discount and free shipping. Ixl takes the guesswork out of lesson planning for teachers. IXl's ready-made lesson plans are aligned to your textbooks and state standards so teachers can turn to IXl for the exact content they need to help their students get started [email protected]/Leaders. When you work with Quest food management services, you're going to feel good about the food you serve your students.
That's because the food is real and it's made from scratch and locally sourced. Learn more about Quest food management [email protected], or follow Quest food on social media. That's questfms.com dot. All right, I am. I'm super excited. I'm here with Ryan and can't wait to hear what he wants to be coached on today. But if I remember correctly, and Ryan, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think on your application, there are a lot of interesting things you wanted to work on. But I really resonated with this idea. I think you mentioned I never even considered getting coached right as a school leader till I listened to this podcast. Is that correct?
As I mentioned before we hit recordI figure, hey, let's deliver great value to you, but I think the Ruckus Maker listening will have some similar questions and we'll be able to help them out as well. And the bigger push that I'm making is that school leaders are worth it and deserve great coaching and mentorship. Maybe that's me, and that's great if we're a good fit. But there's plenty of coaches right out there and there's mastermind groups, as you know. And I think the kind of leaders that I attract, I'm the one who wants to work with Ruckus Makers, right? Who wants to do school different, who wants to make shifts on their campus. And so, yeah, just setting up the episode. We won't do that every time, but I am all yours. What would be helpful to discuss today? What are you working on?
07:18
Ryan
I think that as a whole, just the coaching aspect, it's funny that donned me when I was fishing out that application and I'm telling staff, hey, we always have to be in this continuous improvement cycle and teach FX. I went in, I dove into that a little bit after you had chatted with me. I'm on a zoom call here. Good to see you, though. Anyway, soI dove into Teach FX and just that personalized coach from the, with AI for teachers, and I'm like, holy smokes, if I'm expecting my teachers to reflect, to be getting better, yeah, now I gotta be doing the same and I sell it to staff. I hate to say Tom Brady's probably the best quarterback to ever play the game and seasons. He didn't ever take it offI mean, he had a coach and was he smarter than that coach? Did he have experience in that coach? Yeah, absolutely. But there is always something you can learn from somebody and then you sit down and just bounce ideas off of each other. So I do. I totally support coaching, and I'm excited about this opportunity.
08:26
Danny
I love to tell people, too, whether I'm speaking keynote, doing a workshop or whatever, coaching, like, listening for the one thing to take awayI hope you find the whole time well worth your investment. But what's the one thing that you're going to hear today that could be a game changer for you? Right. And I say that to the listener who's observing our conversation as well. So, yeah, super stoked that you set this up. So what might be a dream? You're working on a shift. You're trying to make it on campus, a challenge that's got you frustrated, but, yeah. How can I help?
09:06
Ryan
Well, I thinkI started your book on building leadership momentum and that 90 day challenge. Just so my focus. Our focus right now is school. Right now obviously, it's the fourth quarter. Always smokes its course in the fourth quarter. Are you kidding me? But just focusing on finishing this year strong, and we have a few initiatives where we're laser focused on them. What we can get accomplished at the end of this year. But then I told staff, hey, we're building towards next year because I want to hit the ground running next year. And I think one of the big things that intrigues me is that whole 90 day, the principal entry plan. I just feel like all year long, and there's other factors in it, too, but I just feel like I've been playing ketchup.
09:55
Ryan
I mean, this is my first year as a lead administrator. I was assistant principal for nine years. But I feel like I just can never get ahead. So, I mean, that. Really interested in that 90 day plan and just having that set up next year is to take some of the stress off my life and more importantly, stress off staff's life, and then staff are less stressful. You're gonna have students less stressful, parents less stressful. I mean, it's a. It's a good thing.
10:27
Danny
First of all, congratulations on almost finishing the year. And I think about this.
10:34
Ryan
We're not done yet, right?
10:36
Danny
Sure, sure. But I think with a 90 day plan. You'll have a really great focus. I'll have to look up. I probably should do that while we're recording here, because we're recording just for the Ruckus Maker listening. We're recording here. It's March, so we've turned third base. We're looking at a. The end of the school year type of thing. But by the time. By the time this episode comes out, it'll actually be next fall. So, which is totally cool. And the thing that I want to highlight here are two things. One, build leadership momentum. I'm really proud of that book because it solves just a very concrete problem, which is how. All right, I got hired as a principal. What does it look like to create an entry plan?
11:17
Danny
But what you did, Ryan, is really quite clever and right on. There can be 490 day plans a year, and that's something, actually right now in the mastermind in the spring here. We're reading this book as a community because we want to finish the year strong. And so everything I teach in that book or what we talk about today in our call, yes, it's a great way to start the year, but it's also how you end the year. And it's also in the middle of the year, too. It's 490 day plans. The other thing I'll say is you talked about, like, calmer teachers. Right. Or if they're doing better, the kids will be doing better 100%. There's a guy I really admire, a close friend, and we've worked together for ages, too, Doc Jones.
12:03
Danny
And he has a podcast called Seeing the lead in a book called Seeing the lead. But he really is a huge proponent of taking care of your teachers because out of their overflow of feeling supported and all of that, they are able to do better for kids. And I think the last thing I'll say is, I don't know if you caught it, but my fifth book is called Calming the chaos. And so if you're looking for some ideas, too, and case studies and ways to think about how to bring the temperature down at times and be a calming presence for your staff, that's a good resource. So with all that said, let's talk, like, 90 day plan, and how can I help you here with finishing the year strong and then start next year with great momentum.
12:51
Ryan
Hey, could you, like, what is the order of your books?
12:56
Danny
Yeah. So the first one was called better leaders, better school.
13:00
Ryan
If I wanted some reading right now, like, what would that sequential order things be?
13:05
Danny
I would say, like, whatever problem you want to work on. So if it's, like, an entry plan and 90 day planning, that it seems like that'll be a big part of the content of our call today, too. So that's build leadership momentum. There's a book about three year vision. So when you're in a place ready to do some strategic thinking about the long term game plan for your campus. And actually, like, all my frameworks focus on Ryan, the individual, Ryan's family and then school. So there's stuff there, too. About three years. Who do you want to be in your life personally, and what are the things you want to see happen within your family in the next three years? So that book is called a remarkable vision formula. That was my fourth book.
13:50
Danny
The fifth book is calm and chaotic, and that's about applying the four virtues of wisdom, courage, justice, and temperance from ancient stoic philosophy to the challenges of modern day school leadership. Book number one was better leaders, better schools, and a roadmap. And that was clearly my first book. It has good content, but it's not as well organized as the other books. Right. So it's okay, but people still buy that all the time and enjoy it. And my second book, first bestsellers, called Unlocking Talent within every school leader. There's two reasons to check out that book. Maybe one would be it describes why our Ruckus Maker, mastermind, works, and so it paints that picture in case that's something you ever want to explore.
But the second reason to read that book is it gives you the framework of why it works, and you could take that framework and use parts of it within your leadership, within your school to better serve your staff. So that's kind of like a culture builder and a way of approaching professional development for your team as well. Got you.But back to 90 day planning, if that is relevant. And helpful for you. Like, what questions do you have around there? What are you thinking in terms of gearing up for the end of the year? How can I help?
15:11
Ryan
One of the big focuses is we are. We're looking into redoing our bell schedule again, and we haven't redone the bell schedule in a while, but we have 49 minutes classes right now. It's a seven period day. We have the end of the day. We call that. I mean, we're now referring to it as our win time, which is what I need. And it's just. It's just too fast for students. So are my teachers. They need more time. Ideally, I would like to have a bell schedule. That is you have 60 minutes of math, 60 minutes of language arts every day, and then that 45 minutes wind time, and then everything else kind of, I don't know, alternating or what that would look like, but I don't think I can build a schedule like that.We'll see where we go with scheduling. But next year, tooI really want to focus on that wind time, which is what I need because I think middle schools, it's just one of those crazy times. It's life, man. It's just crazy. Middle school teachers are built differently. I'm built differently as a middle school.
16:26
Danny
Admin, like middle school teacher here, middle school principal.
16:30
Ryan
So, yeah, like one day you're thinking, oh, man, I got this, I know this kid. And the next. Dude, what happened? Hubris happened. Well, something happened, but really going to just be pushing staff next year to be thinking of, like, non negotiables for middle school. When kids roll in here at 6th grade and we have 6th, 7th and 8th, and then we send them off to the high school. What are those non negotiable skills? Some skills, talents. I mean, anything that we'll be able to hit when they leave Palmer middle, they'll have. And I could tell everybody over at the high school, hey, like, when you get these kids, they're going to be able to do this, this, and this. And one of them, what do you call them? Sticky points or sticky.
17:23
Danny
Sticky core values, that type of thing.
17:25
Ryan
Core values. Justaim small, miss Small. I think this year I came in with way too many things, and I really need to narrow all that down. Juststaff, we're going to be focusing on those non negotiable skills that our students are going to have by the time they exit middle school. And I think that the focus is going to be probably addressing a lot of that on the. During wind time.
17:57
Danny
Can you describe wind time? Because I think I've seen it in a big Facebook group. Is that the one that, Is that, like, Stephanie's idea or. I'm not sure. How are you.
18:07
Ryan
Not in the Facebook group? I don't.
18:09
Danny
Okay.How do you describe wind time? What is it?
18:13
Ryan
So it's like an advisory class, but I hate when you say advisory or because that usually turns into study hall or that non structured time, but I want to be intentional about everything we do with that. So what it's going to look like or what it's going to look like to finish out this school year. And currently, our wind times are only 30 minutes, which that's not a whole lot of time, but what we've done is we've looked at our math data and again, man, like, you live, you learn. I made so many mistakes along the way to start as we've gone along. But one of the things we should have been focusing on a lot more was our math data. We've looked at the math data and we focused on it, but we could have been far more intentional with it.
19:00
Ryan
So we're being strategic. During the fourth quarter, we're taking all of our kids that are two or more grade levels behind, and that's a scary number. And I told my math team, we're just focusing on the 8th graders right now. Divide up those 88 kids amongst yourselves. Whatever skills you guys prioritize for algebra, that's what your focus is going to be finishing out this school year, so that when we send our kids over to the high school, they are going to be ready to rock and roll for algebra. And then we also add some big goals, too, with the writing, and we'll be pushing that, too. But next year, I just want to be far more intentional with that time.
19:43
Ryan
AndI mean, that first week, it's obviously focusing on getting into school, getting into the building expectations, procedures. But I mean, I do, I want it to be, I mean, we should be teaching kids how to take notes. Real note taking was a big push at one time. I want to make it as simple as possible for students in middle school. I mean, a perfect example of this is my daughter just came to my middle school and she started during fourth, or she started two thirds of the way through third quarter. And it's just a huge transition coming into middle school. So we have to make things simple for students. We have to have a routine set up procedures.
20:31
Ryan
So, I mean, they're walking in from an elementary school where they have maybe one to two teachers a day, and then they roll into middle school, and you might be seeing six different teachers, six different sets of expectations, six different, I mean, we kind of have similar rules in the building, but six different personalities, I mean, that's a lot to take in. It's overblown. So just being strategic next year with how we roll out the non negotiables, how we train students to be students at Palmer Junior middle School, how we keep it more simple for them, and then bigger picture, too, is just writing across the curriculum for everybody, right?
21:17
Danny
WellI will say I want to honor this idea of aiming small so I think taking that very broad perspective and goals that you had your first year here as principal and making that tighter is really important. And, and especially if you have system level support. I think a tragic thing that happens in many school districts is that a principal is not allowed to have a tight focus to improve key strategic areas and then move on to the next. And instead, the message is improve it all at the same time and buy a lot. And it's unbelievably unrealistic. The research shows it's unrealistic. Any sort of change management and leadership sort of discussion around these topics knows it's unrealistic. And yet in education, we seem to miss that memo at times.
22:15
Danny
Something I'm thinking about from the shift from elementary to middle and now having six different teachers and that kind of thing. And you mentioned Cornell notes, right? And these sort of organizational skills and that kind of thing you could do Cornell notes, all that kind of deal. I don't know. You listen to podcasts, but sometimes I talk about my buddy Mitch Weathers, and you seem to be somebody who likes to read. So this is. This is his latest book, right? Executive functions for every classroom, but the subtitles really, where the gold is creating safe and predictable learning environments. And the beauty is, the six teachers can still be creative and independent and autonomous.
23:02
Danny
But if they are open to adopting some of the ideas that Mitch prescribes in terms of how we begin class, how do we set the agenda? How do we create goals for our students, how do we end the class? It's a game changer. The book's accessible. It's like $30. He also has an executive functions course that maybe might be a good fit for staff members to go through. And then, of course, he has the flagship organized Binder, which is an actual, like, product. But at least start with the book, you know what I mean? And I'm happy to connect. He'll hop on a call with you, since we know each other, if you ever wanted to chat with him.
23:47
Ryan
Does he have a digital piece for that?
23:49
Danny
Well, the funny thing is, I look through all that. No, the answer is no. Like, he's. He's very committed to analog solutions. So at least if people are interested in organized binder, the service, that is a physical binder, it's not like an e binder. And he's resisted doing that, and that's his choice. You know, as leaders, we gotta choose our edges. But if you're looking for more of a digital experience, I think you could figure out how to adapt the predictable learning routine that he talks about in the book or the course to a digital space. So that's up to you that was.
24:26
Ryan
Looking at that, too. But I just thought, man, he's got a digital piece or. Yeah, because that's one of the things, too, is just student portfolios that'll fall throughout middle school. And then we convinced the high school to have them, too.
24:40
Danny
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25:48
Danny
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26:36
Ryan
So we have PLC's. We have every Monday, it's an hour late start. So teachers have an hour to PLC. And I just sent that out. And there's an activity for the last PLC. And I just want teachers to, right now that's who we're for. Today also is giving me some. They're non-negotiables that they want to focus on. And every middle school kid I walked.
27:03
Danny
Out of here is that by, like, grade level team or core area? How are they meeting to identify that?
27:09
Ryan
I'm not aiming small with this one, just big. And then we'll narrow it down. I don't know if I want to go, I don't know if I want to do great and it's going to hit up to eventually be grade level. I'm starting off broad, going to narrow it down and I'm going to send it out to the high school too. Just say, hey, when, I mean, when you're getting our middle school kids, what skills do you want them to have so that instead of hidden high school with training mills on the, and they're riding the bike already and even parents opening that up to parents too, love it.
27:44
Danny
So yeah, that might be an action item in case you haven't reached out to the high school yet, just to say like what are those fundamental foundational skills that you want your kiddos to have? And then I love the idea of incorporating parents. There was something that we did at a high school that really crushed parents and really it was quite simple. The idea was we know you have hopes, dreams and aspirations for your child and that this kid is the most important, number one human in your life. And we're honored that we get to be a part of your story and that kid's story. Of where they're going. So on these note cards, can you write down like that biggest dream dreamer aspiration you have for that. And my parents wrote it down. Students name their name, the hope dream aspiration. We collected those, but then we found ways to bring that back into the conversation throughout the year, whether that was parent meetings or newsletters or individual phone calls and emails that were going outbound to parents. But essentially we're really just trying to communicate. We care and we see you, we hear you. For the hopes, dreams and aspirations. And we're in this together. You know, we're on the same team and I think that's a powerful message to share with parents. Andunfortunately, maybe not enough schools are actually engaging parents as the experts they are on the students, right. That we work with. So I think you're absolutely right on with that.
29:27
Danny
Plus, that's a topic that parents would want to come in and engage with. We're going to talk about your individual student versus, hey, here we are as experts in education telling you exactly what you need to be doing with your kid. It's reversing the power structure and saying you're the expert. Can we learn from you about your kid? What would you have us know? And that's a fantastic conversation to have.
29:54
Ryan
I mean that's one thing to focus on parents. I think middle school you love your kids in elementary, and then we hit that strange middle school and you're like, whoa. Might be hands off a little while here, but anything we can do to bring them in and engage them 100%.
30:12
Danny
Yeah Something I've talked about before on the podcast as well and put out there, I wish schools would adopt it more, but we have these very, like, traditional status quo events, like come beginning of the school year, open house night type of thing and the graduations, the dances and all that stuff. ButI'm curious, like, okay, we're talking about the hopes, dreams, and aspirations of the kid. What are the hopes, dreams, and aspirations of the parent? What are they trying to do and achieve, right? And if I knew that, is there a way I could bring in experts and speakers and trainers around some of those topics that the parents wanted for themselves as an invitation to engage with the school and build relationships and trust? And if I could provide that content, that's kind of adjacent.
31:04
Danny
To, like, what's happening in the school. But by serving the parents in a powerful way and building that trust in those relationships, now we can have more dialogue about the business of school, too, because they're getting more of what they need. Does that make sense?
31:21
Ryan
Yeah, you open the door, they have a little bit of a platform selling on all the great things happening at school.
31:28
Danny
Yeah, exactly. So something. Something to brainstorm on, for sure, if you want to make that happen. Another cool idea that I learned from a Stanford present professor who works in that design school that they have there, the D school, susie wise. So this is her idea, not mine. I forget what she called it. But in one of these parent engagement nights, she basically had like two lists. And you could do it on a whiteboard, you could do sticky notes, you could do it, figure out how to do it digitally. But list one is things I can teach, things I'm an expert on. And list two things I want to learn. Okay. And then what the school leader did is matched parents based on what they were great at and what they wanted to learn. Right.
32:17
Danny
And you don't discount whatever expertise you might have. So learning how to code or build a computer is not better than learning how to change a tire. And I won't forget that. In the story, Susie told me that one of the most engaging and popular sessions that the school offered was a mechanic who taught single moms how to change tires on their car. They wanted to know that skill, right? And they wanted to be independent, and he was able to help out a lot of people in that sense. So That's another great way of just, like, building bridges within the community. But the school is the hub for that. Right. And again, those positive connections then get transferred to you. And now I think Ryan's just the best principal ever because he did this for me.
33:09
Ryan
Well, they know that already.
33:11
Danny
Well, they know it already, so now he's the best in the world.
33:15
Ryan
Yeah.
33:16
Danny
Yeah. Great. I love that.
33:19
Ryan
No, that's a good idea. We do a lot of unfortunate things because we have a love and logic parenting coach that's on staff, and he. We tried doing it all the time to get to class. He's doing classes all the time. I mean, the guy just loves diving in and helping out parents there.
33:39
Danny
Brilliant.
33:40
Ryan
I feel like I'm kind of his handler. Anybody's got an issue, like, I got just the guy for you.
33:45
Danny
Yeah, of course.
33:45
Ryan
I use them, too. Like those?
33:47
Danny
Yeah, 100%. Cool. Anything else regarding 90 day plan stuff and finishing the year strong?
33:55
Ryan
Yeah, just filling it up. I don't know if you ever reached that point as an administrator, but just doing a better job of feeling ahead, balancing things, because it just does. It takes up a lot of time. And I got a family, too, and, I mean, they need to be the focus. So just working on balancing work, balancing.
34:19
Danny
Home life, those are important topics a lot of principles wrestle with, for sure. I was just talking to a private client of mine, Bill, and he was sharing all his wins with his family and the fact that he's working out, he's eating well, and he's sleeping eight to 9 hours a night. And Bill's experience. Yeah, right. But he's atypical. But I'll tell you, he said, ‘Danny, we've been working together for years. I've been listening to the show as well, and stuff is finally starting to click. I've been listening, I'm putting it into practice, and it's starting to click.’ So on some level, it's about systems. So they say that whatever results you're seeing in your life or in your leadership, those results are a perfect outcome on the system you've created or that you're operating within.
And so if you want different outcomes, like more time with family or whatever, eight to 9 hours of sleep, then what can you tweak within your system to arrive at that outcome? You know what I mean? So, yeah. What part of do you want to talk about balance more? Do you want to talk about getting ahead first? What? Where do you want to go? Probably. Balance sounds good. So something that I do with clients at times and Ruckus Makers is like, think about, like, what an ideal day looks like for you, right. So if you had a magic wand and you were still principally doing the principlizing. And doing it well not mailing it in there, what would a. What would a perfect day look like for you?
35:59
Ryan
Perfect day? I always drop a perfect day the night before, and then it goes to craziness. Walking into the office, but a perfect day. Man, I wish I was a morning person because I am not, but that's ideal. You know, wake up, workout, get a game plan for the day, and then come into school with. Yeah, you work out, you feel better, obviously ready to rock and roll. Got the day all nice and lined out, getting into classrooms, talking to teachers, meeting with the leadership team. I mean, everything. Just everybody in the front office getting along, parents helping parents cross the road just, yeah, nice day at school. And then, I don't know what time, go home after that. I really feel like I get home and that's where my email time is because I don't get to check my inbox during the school day. So then I got kids that want to jump all over me and I'm like, whoa, put the swords away until I let me do a couple emails here. And then swords come out and they go to bed and, yeah, I go back into eating barrels there and get them ready for the next day. And this is middle school, man. I can't even imagine if you're high school and you've got all these after school athletic events and weekend events.
37:18
Danny
Yeah, totally. For sure. So not a morning person. Does that mean you're a night owl? It's totally. It doesn't matter. There's no right or wrong.
37:26
Ryan
Yeah, no, I like staying up. Yeah, but you can't work out before you go to bed, so. Because then you stay up later, so that. Yeah, at some point maybe I got to change self discipline.
37:39
Danny
If you were working out consistently, what would you want to do for a workout?
37:43
Ryan
Or I would say cardio. Just overall healthier, eating better, I guess. Building more systems to make it. I mean, building out meal plans for the week, too. Just making things easier on my wife.
37:57
Danny
Yeah, there's wisdom there because it does.
38:00
Ryan
It gets busy. Yeah, we've always wanted to sit down and say, hey, let's knock this out on Sundays and just make a meal plan for the week, but that never comes to fruition. Because something else comes up and we decide to go do that.
38:14
Danny
Yeah, I've done some Sunday cooking with my wife. It's a nice time, too. It's definitely not a date, but I find, like, if we can chat, it's a good connection time with you. Sounds like you have a few kids, is that right? I know you got the one that's at middle school with you. How many kids do you have?
38:30
Ryan
I have five.
38:31
Danny
Okay, awesome.
38:32
Ryan
I got a senior, junior, 8th grader, and then I have a third grader and am going to be kindergartener next year.
38:39
Danny
Okay. You know what they call that?
38:41
Ryan
Crazy?
38:43
Danny
No. A basketball team. You got enough? You got all five positions, so.
38:51
Ryan
Well, the littles think we're more of a superhero team and.
38:55
Danny
Yeah, for sure. For sure. Cool. With the cardio piece. And based on where you live, I'm guessing, working outside isn't always possible. So if. If you are able to work out, is it like, you have a bike at home or a treadmill or is it like going to a gym?
39:12
Ryan
Treadmill. It's there. It looks nice.
39:23
Danny
Are there clothes hanging on it and that kind of thing?
39:25
Ryan
No, my wife is very clean, so there's no clothes sitting off of it. But there might be dust on it.
39:31
Danny
Right. Okay. What would it be? Okay, so we'll try to circle back to cardio, and we might revisit this, too, just because of. Because of time. But something I noticed that you said. So I'll just reflect back to you. Wake up, workout, game plan. And then at school, you get into classes, you're talking to teachers, and the front office runs smoothly. You said something about crossing parents across the street.
39:56
Ryan
Oh, both ladies need help crossing the street over here.
39:59
Danny
I can just lend a hand. Okay. And meeting with the help and meeting with the leadership team. I appreciate that helpful heart. So that's your work day, then you said, whatever time, go home. Right. And then it's email time before kids and swords, and then bed and email. Okay. And more email. So you talk about email a lot, right? So that's interesting. But where my coach's brain goes, you said, whatever time you go home. Tell me more about that.
40:32
Ryan
It all just depends on the day. We have after school events going on. You know, stay and supervise those parent phone calls. I don't like to leave a pair of phone calls until the next day, when I see that my phone is beeping. So I did one lead, one from yesterday. But, yeah, I don't have, like, a set time that I leave. It just kind of bleeds over sometimes.
40:55
Danny
Got it. Okay. Do you have an administrative team? It's a middle school. Do you have other eps and stuff?
41:00
Ryan
Yeah, I have an assistant.
41:01
Danny
Do you all go to all the events? Like, the whole team goes to every event?
41:05
Ryan
It's middle school, so we don't have as many as the high school.It's always during the week and, I don't know, there's not a ton of them. But, yeah, we divvy those up at times.
41:16
Danny
So you do divide them at times. You don't all go, yeah. Okay. I think that's great. That's definitely an area of opportunity because if you're not at all the events and you divide them up, then obviously you can go home and do other things. Other types of things. So if there's not an event, when would be an ideal time to go home?
41:33
Ryan
What time do we get? Students are out of the building at 230, staff leaves at three. I don't know what that ideal time is. I mean, I usually roll out of here at 05:00 ish.
41:46
Danny
What are you usually doing between three and five? If. Yeah. What are you usually doing during that time?
41:51
Ryan
We have meetings after school, just seeing what's going on with teachers, different clubs, checking in on those. And that'sI can get into emails. Like, I don't know what other buildings look like with emails, but, I mean, at the end of the day, I'll walk out looking at it. I'll have 70, 80 emails in that inbox. And we've triedI've come in and I've said, hey, I hate email guys. So here's how it works. Like, if you're emailing me, I want it to be for a task. Like it's something that somebody needs to get done. If it's just a quick question we have, we use Microsoft Teams in the building, so can throw those teams questions out to anybody. We have. Yeah, we have a. What am I looking?
42:33
Ryan
Not a group, but yeah, I mean, a PGMS staff team set up and it's broken down into a bunch of different channels. So, I mean, I can just focus on the channels that I need to focus on, like the discipline, the tier three discipline one. And then I canglance through those channels. But I try to say, hey, guys, like, it's an email that something I need to do. That's when it's an email to me. Otherwise, just put it in teams and you try.
43:00
Danny
So that means that it's not been successful yet.
43:03
Ryan
Like fully listening, it's been successful because the emails have comecut down drastically. Butyou're still looking at 70 at the end of the day.
43:12
Danny
That's a lot of those 70 emails, how many of them are garbage, like don't really even, aren't worth reading and not worth your time or a response?
43:21
Ryan
Well, when I look at those 70, we have confidential conflict reports. So I get CC'd on any of those that students fill out. So there's a handful of those. Just a handful of emails or a lot of emails that people just cc me on just because they want me to be aware of it, whether it's a special education issue or just an NTSS issue or student or whatever. And then the ones that I have to take action on, I mean, there's a handful in there too.
43:52
Danny
Okay. Do you have an executive assistant or principal secretary type of role?
43:57
Ryan
I have an admin secretary, yeah.
43:59
Danny
Does he or she just work with you or with all the admin or.
44:03
Ryan
She oversees the front office there. It's not like my first line of defense. I mean, she is at times when I schedule things, but not when those emails coming through.
44:16
Danny
Do you think she's operating at full capacity? You think she thinks you're leveraging all the gifts that she has as a front office leader?
44:25
Ryan
So, yes, I think, well, I mean, I could always do better. You know, nobody ever bats 1000 at anything. But this year has kind of been a transition time too because we, years ago were cut from the front office position, so everybody had to dive in and do things differently. And then this year we got that position back so we were able to spread everything out more. But then this year's kind of been an adventure too because we had one of our registrars take another job. So then you got another registrar midway through the year. So her job basically been training everybody up to be able to do the new jobs because you got a new athletic activity. Secretary, she's training up. Getting a registrar, she's training up. So there's been a lot of training on our plate this year.
45:15
Danny
That makes sense. Okay. Yeah. So it sounds like email definitely takes up, I think, a lot of school leaders time. This is quite great, I'm excited because I think it's a really great opportunity to work with you. And, if we can, even reduce it or build some systems that, yeah, change things, like 20%, 50%whatever like that would be. That would free up a nice amount of time for you. I'd like to keep chatting about it. We're kind of at the end of our call, so we'll need to continue that. But if you also think it's worthy, then I've made a note that's something. I have a few ideas. Can I share them before we end our call?
45:57
Ryan
Yeah, absolutely.
45:59
Danny
So one thing that we do within the Ruckus Maker, mastermind, each month, I kind of. I do a special teaching and create a tool. And one of those things is on what I call creating a communication policy. So I'll make a little note to get you access to it. And then before our next call, if you could watch the video and look at the tool. The videos are all short, so it's like less than ten minutes for sure. And then just so we have something to base our discussion on. But I think, like, well, I should ask, do you feel like you have a formal communication policy for your staff so they know, like, what works for you and, like, what the rules are, so to speak, interacting and communicating with.
46:46
Ryan
Ryan, I don't think it's crystal clear. Other than that, I hate emails. Like, it's skyright that I would like.
46:56
Danny
Hey, bro, we're in the same club. We're in the same club, so it's all good. So I see that as an area of opportunity, and I'd like to get you access to that, and then we'll chat about it more on our next call. The other thing that just seems like super low hanging fruit, the ccs. And again, correct me if I'm wrong, if I'm reading the situation, but it sounds like you're CC'd on a lot of stuff. And my wondering is, like, let's say it's a special ed related issue, right? I mean, you could read it, but I'm guessing you already meet with the special ed team so if that assumption is correct, they can just tell you at the meeting and that email could, like, stop being sent to you. You know what I mean? Because when.
47:39
Danny
When they have facetime and you're fully present then you could be kept abreast of all the stuff that might be a change potentially to make, maybe because you're cC'd on all this stuff. The other. The other thing, it depends on your comfort level, but I've worked with some principles, leveraging their front office staff or their executive assistant to help them with email where they kind of create a daily digest. Right. SoI don't know if your system has rules around that or anything like it, but if you have autonomy there an executive assistant, their roles to make you be great and to let you bring your superpower to campus. Your superpower is not reading and processing and responding to emails efficiently. That's just, that's not it. You're leading a building.
48:30
Danny
So long story short if she was able to look at those cc's and here's like kind of the summary of the things that are going on there, and then you just had a five to ten minute daily or every other day get together. Okay, Ryan, here's the things to be aware of. That would cut down and she could archive those emails, she could put them in a folder for you know what I mean? And so that might be a way of potentially doing it too. So homework, I think, is like my challenge for you. I'll get you the link to that communication policy content. And then the other thing is I actually want you to.
49:13
Ryan
What's that called? What's that? Sorry. Access to. Danny, intimidate.
49:16
Danny
I'm going to invite you to a private space that's usually for Ruckus Maker, mastermind people. Right. So you're getting like, okay, special access to something. So I'll email you a link and then you'll. You'll get access to it.
49:29
Ryan
Don't mean the club, Danny. I mean the club.
49:32
Danny
You're getting there. You're getting there. There's all sorts of stuff. So what was I going to say? Oh, and the other thing I want you to think about, like what is the perfect time to go home? I'd love for you to set a concrete time. It's going to be flexible based on events that happen within your school. But I'd love for you to think about and establish, like, I go home at this time every day and it sounds like if you have from three to five at the end of the day, that's a lot of time to do administrative type of things because what I want to hopefully do is really decrease the time spent on email when you get home. Like when you first get home before time with kids.
50:19
Danny
And then you said in bed, like you don't want to end your day looking through that garbage either, in my opinion. So that sounds good. That'll be a bit of our approach. So in closing, though, Ryan, like, what do you think was most helpful from today?
50:33
Ryan
Just the process, man. I'm excited about this. Like, it's one of, it's me putting my money where my mouth is here, you know? I mean, I'm telling staff, hey, coaching is a good thing. This Teach FX is good. It gives you instant feedback. If I'm expecting them to learn to grow, then I need to be doing the same thing, you know?
50:54
Danny
Okay, cool. We're going to be doing that. So I'm honored that you reached out, and I'm glad that we're working together. So thanks for your time today.
51:03
Ryan
All right, we take it easy.
51:07
Danny
Thanks for listening to the Better leaders Better Schools podcast. Ruckus Maker. How would you like to lead with confidence, swap exhaustion for energy, turn your critics into cheerleaders and so much more? The Ruckus Maker Mastermind is a world class leadership program designed for growth minded school leaders just like you. Go to betterleadersbetterschools.com mastermind, learn more about our program and fill out the application. We'll be in touch within 48 hours to talk about how we can help you be even more effective. And by the way, we have cohorts that are diverse and mixed up. We also have cohorts just for women in leadership and a BIPOC only cohort as well. When you're ready to level up, go to betterleadersbetterschools.com mastermind and fill out the application. Thanks again for listening to the show. Bye for now and go make a ruckus.
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